OT: Scandal at Draft Kings, Fan Duel
They have rules barring employees from playing on their own sites, but not the competitors. Not surprised to see such shadiness or to see NFL owners involved in the companies.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/06/sports/fanduel-draftkings-fantasy-emp…
October 6th, 2015 at 4:31 PM ^
DFS is basically the Wild West right now. It was only a matter of time before something like this happened.
October 6th, 2015 at 6:05 PM ^
As long as they stop advertising I'm fine with it.
October 6th, 2015 at 7:51 PM ^
Aren't they legal businesses? Why should legal businesses not be able to advertise?
EDIT: probably because you're sick of the ads, never mind.
October 6th, 2015 at 11:42 PM ^
For the same reason that you don't see advertisments for casino's on TV. For me it's the "we're giving away 75 million every week!" line. Yeah 75 million when most of your power players are putting in 600 to 900 team submissions a week. Both Fan Duel, and Draft Kings are good for only one thing. Taking money from schmucks who think they will win a million dollars from a one week fantasy league.
October 9th, 2015 at 10:07 AM ^
The government advertises the lottery. That is gambling. What exactly is the difference?
October 6th, 2015 at 4:37 PM ^
Hmmph... I bet the guys in the Gronk jerseys winning the million on Draft Kings are actually Fan Duel programmers!
October 6th, 2015 at 6:56 PM ^
about "scandal" but we're in for some heavy regulation, I believe.
October 6th, 2015 at 4:36 PM ^
What is this "Fan Duel" and "Draft Kings" you speak of? I am not familiar with these companies.
Maybe they should consider advertising more often.
October 6th, 2015 at 4:48 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 7:04 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 6:02 PM ^
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October 6th, 2015 at 4:39 PM ^
Will this end the commercials?
Please say yes.
October 6th, 2015 at 4:40 PM ^
The whole thing seems a bit like playing poker while the dealer can see your hand. Is anyone aware of real-life examples of anyone winning money on these sites?
October 6th, 2015 at 4:43 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 4:49 PM ^
Winning the huge bucks is like winning the lottery. You can be an expert, and you still need the cards to fall the right way to win a lot. I play in tournaments ranging from $3-$10 and I am up $100 so far this football season. Not a lot but I will take it. I also won $150 one night during baseball season and cashed out using paypal and got the money the next day.
October 6th, 2015 at 5:00 PM ^
I also read some where that some nerds have some super baseball algorithm and the same 50 people win about 91% of all winnings
October 6th, 2015 at 5:02 PM ^
- NERDDDDS
October 7th, 2015 at 1:07 AM ^
I would like to request that a fellow nerd share that algorithm with me.
October 6th, 2015 at 7:17 PM ^
a friend of mine won money on golf and football, draft kings paid out on time. but it was pretty minor cash in grand scheme of things, certainly not 6-7 figures or anything like that
October 6th, 2015 at 8:18 PM ^
...but the dealer isn't playing. They don't care who wins--they get their 10-12% rake regardless.
My guess is they'll swing the hammer pretty heavily on this. They're fighting a regulatory battle over whether they're a gambling site or not and they could easily be regulated right out of existence if they aren't careful. They've got every incentive to run a clean game.
October 6th, 2015 at 4:41 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 4:41 PM ^
By everything I've read, both FD and DK are basically rigged for most of the userbase, with a couple heavy-duty pickers getting the bulk of the wins. It's just gambling anyway, so if you can afford to lose some money go for it. I just hate the unrelenting advertising.
October 6th, 2015 at 6:22 PM ^
I agree that it's totally gambling. Wagering on how a football player performs is not that different than wagering on what spot a marble settles into when dropped in a spinning bowl. However, how is it rigged? Unless the NFL games themselves were rigged, it's still just people (or computers) picking players they think will put up stats. Sure some people have great analytics and probably even insider NFL info on gameplans and starting/sitting decisions of coaches. But ultimately if you pick the 10 guys who put up the best stats you win. It certainly involves a ton of luck, but I just dont get how it can be rigged. It's not like fantasy football info that matters isn't widely available. Players that a lot of people select have just as good a chance of putting up points than do obscure players. Right? please tell me Im right.
October 6th, 2015 at 6:39 PM ^
Maybe not in a little league, but certainly in trying to win a big pool. Here's a relevant quote from a recent interview with a professional player.
He also has a technique for identifying athletes who aren’t going to end up on a lot of other team’s rosters, which is important, because there’s a particular advantage in choosing players no one else has noticed.
Here's the source. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-09-10/you-aren-t-good-enoug…
People that have access to that inside information have a real advantage, even over the pros.
October 6th, 2015 at 10:36 PM ^
Because the services are basically mirror images of each other at this level - picking the best team that is distinct enough to beat everyone else - having access to information about roster trends would be invaluable because you'd know which players might be available and that are over-used. By all accounts, there is a huge overlap between the two services during football season.
October 7th, 2015 at 7:08 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 4:42 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 4:45 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 4:48 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 4:54 PM ^
As is poker. More than fantasy.
October 6th, 2015 at 5:02 PM ^
The gaming lobby and state lotteries aren't happy with losing their monopoly on gambling. They've been writing some very big checks to make this go away. This "scandal" is only the ammunition that was needed to make that move seem legitimate. Then they move offshore and advertise in the backs of magazines.
*I did my best to stay non-political on a very political subject. If the mods feel I've strayed too far feel free to delete it.
October 6th, 2015 at 7:37 PM ^
That only holds up with a season long fantasy league though.
These single day leagues are just luck, i.e. online gambling
October 6th, 2015 at 11:46 PM ^
Entering hundreds of submissions a week is not skill. It's throwing shit at a wall, and hoping that some of it sticks to make a profit. It is the epitome of gambling.
October 7th, 2015 at 7:53 AM ^
these sites do.
October 6th, 2015 at 5:21 PM ^
First let me say that I agree with you, I think both should be considered games of skill or considered pure gambling. But, if I had to differentiate, I would say the difference is that in poker the next card is always a matter of pure odds. You can know those odds, but it still comes down to chance that the card will or will not work in your favor. In fantasy sports, what the player lacks control over is not pure luck or chance, it is actually controlled by third party actors with their own skills. If I'm being all lawyerly, I think this is enough to differentiate the two forms of entertainment.
What I can never comprehend is how daily fantasy is any different than standard sports gambling. To me they both require very similar skills. You have to understand the quality of specific teams/players, how they'll matchu-up, etc. You have to judge where a team or player is undervalued (either with a poor line by the oddsmakers or an underpriced player by the daily fantasy sites). About the only difference is there is some value in daily fantasy to knowing which undervalued assets the public isn't hitting on. But I think this would only determine how much you win, not necesserily if you'll win.
October 6th, 2015 at 8:07 PM ^
You're betting that you can outplay your opponents in a variety of ways. A lot of money is won or lost without the next card even getting dealt.
October 7th, 2015 at 2:10 PM ^
Of course there is a lot more to poker than simply what is the next card. Just like in fantasy football there is skill in identifying good matchups for certain players. I was just identifying the aspect in each game of which the player has zero control over. In poker, it is what card will turn up, in fantasy sports it's the performance of athletes. One is purely based on odds, one is based on independent actors' performances. It's a small difference, but a difference.
October 9th, 2015 at 12:42 PM ^
a friend of mine earned his living playing. He is a genius, a gifted software guy, and a very experienced gambler.
He built a set of tools that maintained a database on every player he encountered. Over time he had models of individual player tendencies that gave him a huge advantage over various players. He'd cruise sites looking for "weak" tables, join and clean up.
Point here is that casual players, whether at poker or selecting fantasy lineups, basically hand the experts their money even if the experts don't have access to inside information. Unless the money you lose is worth the entertainment value of playing, you're far better off finding another amusment.
October 6th, 2015 at 8:13 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 11:17 PM ^
A very legitmate point in my eyes; fascinating how this cannot be considered gambling, when arrests of bookmakers are still surely being made.
Reminds me of years ago when StubHub came on the scene, and that wasn't scalping, but when Joe sold tickets outside of the stadium, that was scalping
October 6th, 2015 at 4:43 PM ^
How have I never heard of either of these companies? They should advertise a bit more.
edit: damnit beaten by mGrowOld
October 6th, 2015 at 4:43 PM ^
October 6th, 2015 at 4:49 PM ^
so, if i work at a casino, i must know how betting works--therfore i shouldn't be allowed to go play games at another casino?
October 6th, 2015 at 4:52 PM ^
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October 6th, 2015 at 4:55 PM ^
the same.
These people are using the data from their own companies to go make their fantasy teams on another site. It doesn't work that way with casino games, if it did it would be outlawed.
I would guess most employees of LV sportsbooks are barred from placing bets at their employer or any other casino sports book.
October 6th, 2015 at 4:56 PM ^
but it is(was?) true, at least in Atlantic city
http://www.nytimes.com/1991/07/14/nyregion/casino-employees-seeking-per…