OT: Why Doesn't UEFA Just Secede From FIFA?
I mean Sepp Blatter just got re-elected again... The only UEFA members that would oppose leaving FIFA would be some former Eastern Bloc countries and Russia.
They don't make the money anyway in UEFA. The Russian Premier League is at best the 8th ranked league in Europe. Their top teams like CSKA, Spartak and Zenit rarely make it out of group stages/Rd of 16 in UCL.
If powerhouses like Germany, Spain, France, Portugal, Italy, England and Holland just leave, what's FIFA going to do? Those countries are the main cashcows outside of Brazil, Argentina, Chile (eh) and Uruguay (kinda). They will also take most of western Europe with them, so countries like Belgium etc. I'm sure CONCACAF countries like Mexico and the US would follow suit too along with some AFC members like Japan, South Korea etc.
What's holding them back? It can't just be "love of the game" or "world unity" crap.
Agreed that the money goes all the way to the top. France and Spain, for example, actually voted for Blatter. I agree with the OP that those two countries don't need FIFA but someone with power in those countries is clearly in Sepp's camp.
Wouldn't they be pretty much walking away from the World Cup? As bad as FIFA is, do you really piss away competing in the biggest event in your sport?
They could easily make their own World Cup. Yeah it would suck to have 2 competing World Cups, but...
That's a lot of bargaining power right there... Granted a lot of players that play on UEFA club teams might play in FIFA's WC anyway due to their nations supporting FIFA instead of UEFA, but FIFA's WC would be nothing compared to UEFA's in terms of viewership and popularity.
Not if europe and the USA depart...Sure, you would walk away from the world cup, but it wouldn't considered the world cup without Germany, England, Italy, Brazil, USA, Japan, Mexico, and Canada. The way FIFA is set up now, where power and money isn't distributed based on your prowess is a significant reason why the big soccer countries are at least floating the idea of leaving. Besides, if they were serious enough to take steps towards that direction, advertising money would quickly balance towards the top cup contenders and major fan bases in the FIFA off shoot.
This is an interesting article by Nate Silver on just this.
Sorry...I meant Bolivia
Apparently, it hasn't been the World Cup since 1986.
Yeah, apparently the current World Cup isn't the "real World Cup" either, at least according to coldnjl, considering that Canada has never been in it. LOL.
Correction: They've been there exactly once. 1986. The point still stands, though.
It wouldn't be the World Cup without Japan? Do you even watch soccer?
Canada plays soccer?
I don't think people would miss Canada and Japan too much, but your general point still stands. If UEFA, the US and Mexico, and a few CONMEBOL nations including Brazil and Argentina started their own tournament, FIFA would be completely screwed.
The way it works now, there are 209 nations in FIFA and all of them get an equal cut of the revenue from the World Cup. In 2014, that money came out to less than $1,000,000 per country for the 209 nations in FIFA if you can believe that. For bigger soccer nations like England, Brazil, and the US, that's not a very significant part of their budget for the year. But for Haiti and Tahiti that money is a big deal. Anyway, without the most popular teams competing, the World Cup would stop getting lucrative sponsorship deals and would basically stop being very profitable. FIFA gets virtually all of its money from the World Cup, so with that money out of the picture, there would be no financial incentive for less important soccer nations like Haiti or Mali to be a part of FIFA. Basically, they'd eventually be forced to accept whatever terms the new confederation was offering because each of those smaller countries need that money to run their own soccer federation. Also, while FIFA has a ton of money in reserve, they couldn't last forever either if the one event that pays all of their bills suddenly stopped being profitable.
If the most powerful and important soccer nations were to realize that they hold all the power and get on the same page, they could dicate terms to everyone else and the rest of the world would probably have to agree to them. It could be a good way to set up a new system with a more transparent organization in charge instead of FIFA.
The ironic thing in all of this is that the small countries with small budgets are the countries who should care the most about the World Cup being incredibly profitable (USA 2022 = huge stadiums, higher ticket prices, more sponsorship deals, etc.) but instead most of those smaller nations just sell their vote to the highest bidder. I honestly don't know if what they got paid to vote for Qatar, or to re-elect Sepp last week, is more than what the difference in revenue would've been by having the World Cup in the US. But I guess the key difference is that the bribes usually go straight into the voter's pocket whereas revenue from the World Cup just goes to each country's federation.
Tony George's seceding from CART was a clusterfcuk of epic proportions leaving two groups of owners with very different visions (CART being more road racing vs. IRL/IndyCar as ovals mostly) competing and splicing the sport for years. What it led to was, essentially, the death of open wheel racing in North America (save for the periodic competing F1 appearance anually in Montreal and for a time at Indy). Indy Racing League (IRL) and now Indycar took a competitive series with varied set ups/power/drivers/powerplants and consolidated with crap designs they uniformed for every team. Oh, and they were competitively corrupt...look up Paul Tracy and the Indianapolis 500 and see what happened.
Bottom line, Tony George's power play didn't really work out as it splintered the series and has left Indycar (once a regular feature on ABC) with only one major tv date and shown on Versus/NBCSN or, god help me, CNBC if rodeo or something more popular is available. The split in Indycar coincided with the rise of NASCAR (a network darling). In the modern era NASCAR matters...Indycar, sadly, doesn't.
I don't know much about soccer either (except to support England and ManCity). Sure, Tony George recognized CART wouldn't survive without Indy but, bottom line, what the hell does he have left? Four weeks in May and a sport Danica Patrick and Tony Stewart (among others) left for NASCAR. Open wheel is a shell of what it once was...and as a fan that sucks.
I do think UEFA could succeed vs. FIFA but for different reasons. UEFA would take a significant number of the top 30 teams in the world. IRL, in splitting with CART did not...they just took the vest venue. Big difference in what you're referencing.
FWIW if soccer had two competing world cups, I would think it world damage that sport as well.
I don't really know if the Indy 500 really made the sport tick or not. With the change came a loss of most premier drivers to NASCAR and relegation to god damned versus. Sure, he had a keystone but the value of it slipped through his hands like sand...much to NASCAR's benefit.
If soccer had two competing world cups but one had most of UEFA, the US, Korea, Australia, Brazil and some of South America it would not kill the sport. Media markets and sponsors run that deal. Nike, VISA, Adidas etc. would go with wherever the major media markets and tv went...that's not with FIFA.
Blatter has to see the writing on the wall and wonder what the hell to do...
That is the trump card they need to start threatening to play if they do not want to be ruled by a bunch of cleptocrats from a zillion rinky dink nations.
They would make a TON more money if the 2022 WC is hosted by the US or Austrailia. Qatar is going to be a disaster. Sponsers are going to bail, some top players may too, and attendance will suck. But a bunch of guys from places like Togo and T&T got PAID, so they get Qatar and the freaking embarrassment that those games will be.
not to mention that with the last world cup, FIFA really got positive momentum in a country with a growing soccer following and disposable income. What logical reason is there to turn it down...none. FIFA paired Russia and Qatar together, allowing for vote collusion between the two sides and serious money moving from despots to FIFA. Why that was allowed is beyond me...not to mention soccer now interupting the EPL and NFL playoffs because you can't play soccer in the summer when it is 140 degrees
No it didn't or at least not as much "positivity" as you would think... Brazilians almost revolted b/c of the ludicrous demands by FIFA and their government.
Given the disaster that was their national team, Brazil collectively took a massive L.
I really hope their government likes that stadium out in the middle of the rain forest...
my post made the assumption based on the above post that it would have been held in the US. I could care less about Brazil
Ah gotcha. I thought you were referring to Brazil supporting FIFA since they got it last time around. Nvm.
A scenario that should play out, but almost certainly will not, is the EPL and the other major European leagues saying they will not postpone their league for the 2022 WC. UEFA would then start organizing their own WC for the summer of 2022 (in either US or England). And due to the threat of the European leagues not paying athletes that play in Qatar, the big South American countries would be under serious pressure, and if they pulled out of Qatar, then FIFA is toast. Well, even if just UEFA pulls out they're toast, but it would be a slower death.
Obviously, that's a dream scenario that will never happen.
They would make more money on their own than with FIFA imo... FIFA separates the checks between all the small island countries and the powerhouses "equally" aka bribes smaller countries with more cash.
Granted it's great they're spreading the game to poorer countries, but the money doesn't even get there for development more than half the time due to Execs pocketing the cash for themselves.
It's impossible for Blatter to have not been involved at some level of the corruption. He will get caught eventually. The only problem is that he seems to be quite arrogant. If he is caught, I could easily see him dragging it out, being obstinate and refusing to resign. He has leverage as the President and is making more money every day.
Sooner or later, someone will find his Switzerland or Cayman Islands bank account.
Except that's the problem... dude has been deflecting corruption claims for 40 years now LOL.
Master politician.
FIFA's legitmacy rests on UEFA and CONMEBOL (for those who don't know that's the South American teams), the latter is the problem. I can't find a detailed breakdown of the vote, but I'm curious how the CONMEBOL nations voted, as the were projected to support Sepp Blatter overall.
Russia supports FIFA. Nuff said
the fact that it is in Russia --- & Putin and all --- a boycott is the type of thing that could lead to actual legitimate conflict.
Besides, Russian soccer is at least fairly good, and they're a major world power in every sense of the word. A legitimate case can me made that Russia deserves the event.
Qatar --- not quite so much. That one is worth boycotting, but it's also a long way off.
All the above, Blatter knows that. UEFA and others may "talk the talk" about leaving FIFA prior to 2018, but we won't "walk the walk." Maybe 2022 ..... although by then, Blatter's probably gone.
knowing Putin, after the cup has been awarded, he will invade Poland. He has invaded Georgia and Ukraine immediately after olympic games have ceased. Douche. That is all.
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/diane-francis/putin-ukraine-invasion_b_488…
is that Latvia is part of NATO and we'd be obligated to come to their defense.
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Like you said, I doubt they boycott 2018, though they have good reason to.
They should start planning for the alternate 2022 cup immediately. I wrote earlier that I didn't think it would happen, but that was before I read that UEFA's head has already made this threat. I think it probably WILL happen. UEFA + the US boycotting Qatar = FIFAs dead, and why wouldn't they want to take this opportunity to kill FIFA and create a new organization that's much more favorable to their federations?
Besides, Russian soccer is at least fairly good, and they're a major world power in every sense of the word.
Like hell they are. They're decent enough to not embarrass themselves at major competitions and that's about it. Whoopee, they tied South Korea and Algeria at the 2014 WC. That doesn't say "major world power."
2 different thoughts there: (1) fairly good at soccer, and (2) "major world power" in terms of a country relevant/important/wealthy enough to be a viable World Cup (or Olympics) host.
Ideally, a World Cup host should be both of those --- or at least one. (Qatar is of course neither)
FWIW, on the soccer front: Russia did make the semifinals of Euro 2008. They typically hang around the 20s in the FIFA rankings (yes, I know those aren't perfect). They're "fairly good." (laser beams shined into the eyes of their GK didn't exactly help them in their elimination game against Algeria last WC)
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plus, the TV rights for the US are the largest single TV fees that fifa gets.
still... no one cares about us. they take us and our money for granted. well, they can take the FBI for granted now too. suck on that homies.
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This line of reasoning assumes that UEFA isn't extremely corrupt in its own right. That is a questionable assumption.
Platini (head of UEFA) voted for Qatar, and also voted to move the event to winter. He ain't no HE-RO
The UEFA and CONCACAF members are the premier teams, drive the economics of the sport, and win the World Cup mostly anyway.