OT: Ford family joins Gores/Gilbert Detroit MLS Bid; Offer Ford Field as stadium
November 3rd, 2017 at 1:55 PM ^
Then I went to a live game. Huge fan of MLS now. The bug will bite in Detroit IMO... Columbus is trash. Different market.
November 2nd, 2017 at 4:24 PM ^
They might get conditional approval for this but I'd be surprised if it was approved without a soccer specific stadium within 2-3 years of the franchise's inception.
This is a bad idea.
November 2nd, 2017 at 4:27 PM ^
Issues both ways:
1) PRO : This pretty much locks up the bid. No way MLS is going to turn down a bid that has the combined strength of Gores/Gilbert and now the Fords behind it.
2) CON: Indoor soccer kind of sucks. Plus, stadium is too big and not really meant for soccer. The stadium will be half empty most games and that really drags down atmosphere.
A lot of the new soccer only stadiums seem to build in some add ons that are soccer specific, particularly for the supporter sections like capo stations etc.
Further......then what the hell did Gilbert just do this deal for the FailJail site in Detroit for. He sold the deal to buy the land next to his casino on the notion that he would put up a soccer stadium. Now, less than a month later after the deal is either done or on its way to done, they say they're not and are going to play at Ford Field?!? This seems shady.
I'm a big soccer fan. I was already leery of the MLS deal without DCFC though I liked the soccer only stadium idea. This seems to be going further south.
November 2nd, 2017 at 6:44 PM ^
Half empty? Try 3/4 empty. Even with a full house, Ford Field would still be a terrible venue for soccer.
November 2nd, 2017 at 4:38 PM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 4:43 PM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 6:29 PM ^
This is a reasonable point. The culture of metro Detroit kind of requires a certain amount of nostalgia for the past. The Detroit Tigers have been an institution for over a century, the Lions and Red Wings for generations, and the moment when the NBA's popularity exploded in the 80s coincided with the Pistons being a great team, a moment now 30 years in the past.
So sports loyalties in the region are passed down as cherished heirlooms. People that live in the area are largely in the area because their ancestors came there, frequently drawn by a burgeoning manufacturing industry that is now mired in decades of decline. Grandparents and parents and children working in the factories, getting a decent home in Taylor or Canton or Roseville. Listening to Ernie Harwell on the radio and seeing hockey at the Olympia or the Joe and watching Isiah Thomas on channel 50.
I've become a larger Tigers fan in absentia than I was in my peak sports days of the late 90s and early 00s when I lived metro Detroit. This is partly because the Tigers stunk at the time. But it is also because watching the Tigers when in California or Minnesota has helped connect me to members of families of both me and my wife, all significant fans of the team.
Detroit's teams are institutions that have been shared by generations of Michigan residents, something that brings us together and reminds us of rose-tinted memories of past joys. Detroit was once the fourth-largest city in the nation, and the sports teams (college included) have histories that reflect this significance.
Now other cities have supplanted Detroit. Cities like Houston and Nashville and Charlotte and Seattle, cities that attract new residents from other locations, new residents already willing to adopt new teams. Expansion teams are easier to adopt in places like that.
Detroit is privileged to have such iconic franchises with such rich histories. But it may be an obstacle to something new.
November 2nd, 2017 at 7:48 PM ^
but to your last point . . . There can be an inherent resistance to something new, but as DCFC has shown, if it's organic and has enough authenticity it can flourish.
People (including Brian) like to rag on DCFC fans as posers and whatnot, which certainly has a kernal of truth; but I'd take their passion over yet another bland corporate expansion (this time assisted by billionares!) any day of the week.
MLS can succeed in Detroit, but not if it's NFL-lite.
November 2nd, 2017 at 8:20 PM ^
November 3rd, 2017 at 10:46 AM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 8:02 PM ^
You have a fair point, but here's what I would argue: Detroit sports fans are very used to having their city shit on by outsiders. When Detroit is chosen for something, like the Super Bowl, it's huge. Miami or New Orleans gets something like that and they're like: sure, that's cool. Detroit is used to not being picked for kickball.
If we are picked, it'll be at the expense of trendy southern cities like Nashville, Phoenix, RDU, Charlotte, etc. That'll be a big deal to people.
We're particular about history and legacies simply because we have them and there's every reason to proud of them; I'd certainly argue that the lack of one isn't a major barrier. To flip an old phrase, it's sufficient but not necessary.
November 2nd, 2017 at 4:40 PM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 9:45 PM ^
my main takeaway . . .?
Those shorts were SCANDALOUS!
November 3rd, 2017 at 3:54 PM ^
is a sad environment. Yeah the shorts were also bad in the 70s. I liked the hair though.
I went to many of these games to watch Trevor Francis. He was a top world class player in his prime. Watching his skills was worth the drive out to the Silverdome.
November 2nd, 2017 at 5:57 PM ^
Boo, pro soccer on turf. But I wonder if Detroit got a team and had good fan turnout, if there'd be an outdoor stadium with grass in the future.
November 2nd, 2017 at 6:06 PM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 7:05 PM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 7:20 PM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 8:05 PM ^
I was just ranting about this with someone else yesterday so I'll just put this here. I still watch MLS (e.g. all these playoff games), but i HATE how it has ruined the national team. US players get soft by taking cushy, no-stress gigs with MLS instead of sweating and working in Europe (or Liga MX). Jordan Morris, I'm lqqking at you. Paul Arriola. Etc. We need a national team entirely filled with guys who are like Pulisic, Yedlin, Wood, etc. who go THERE to get BETTER. Bill Hamid, applause for you. Nagbe, get your butt overseas.
So adding yet more teams to MLS like Detroit, which will be then 94th team or something in MLS, just further waters down an already watered-down league. And a team like Detroit will throw $$$ at some "name" US player to come play, to put butts in seats. And that dude won't stress about losing his job to some up'n'comer b/c he knows he is there to put said butts in said seats. And that player won't get better, in this watered-down, cushy, no-stress league. Go spend a year in Eredivision or Ligue 1 or something and make yourself better forgoodnessake.
See, I already hate the Detroit MLS team.
[When they elect me USA Soccer Czar in February, I will have MLS go to 32 teams, but then split into 16-team upper and lower divisions, and do relegation/promotion of 3 from each. The lower division will be like EPL Championship, with top 2 promoting, and 3rd-6th teams doing four-team, home/home playoff for the one other slot. And have a 6-team playoff for the upper league. Then to ensure everyone plays everyone now and then, have a 32-team cup each year with eight 4-team groups, and seed it so teams that haven't played each other recently will be in the same group. Then the top 16 of the cup do a home/home knockout like UCL, up to one-game title. So that's 30 league games, 6 cup group games -- two less than the MLS's current 38-game sked -- plus playoffs for some teams, plus US Open Cup etc. See? Now that is competitive pressure, at least we get some rel/pro to put a fire under guys' butts.]
November 2nd, 2017 at 9:20 PM ^
Was the national team awesome pre-MLS?
November 3rd, 2017 at 8:56 AM ^
November 3rd, 2017 at 9:59 AM ^
Of course if the MLS were a class league it would help sharpen players skills (and bring many new fans to the game) but the main problem is that the US tries to solve problems by throwing money at it, an emphasis on winning over development, the whole over structured youth club system, and college soccer as the goal for most talented players.
The best players in most sports have an abnormal passion and "play in the park" for hours and hours every single day playing against older kids, learning to be creative and developing sick skills. (see pond hockey for Canadian NHLers). This costs practically no money and is fun. The best youth soccer players then get into pro clubs systems, not to college teams, which are awful "farm systems" for serious players.
As a player,ref and former club president I see parents who expect their kid to become great because they have some foreign coach who practices with them only 2 hours a day, three times a week, plus a couple games where winning is the goal (despite lip service of development). That's not enough and too structured. God forbid we let young talented athletes play multiple sports or play different positions - that's a whole different topic.
Anyway it's pretty clear why many foreign kids come to the US and dominate youth games "magically". If this isn't addressed, it really doesn't make any difference for our national team how good the MLS is.
November 3rd, 2017 at 11:19 PM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 8:07 PM ^
I think maybe the folks making the "no one cares about the MLS" argument have an early-2000's perception of what the MLS is. The MLS currently ranks 3rd among US leagues for attendance on a per-game basis, averaging around 21,000 fans per game. That eclipses both the NBA and the NHL:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_League_Soccer_attendance
November 2nd, 2017 at 8:13 PM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 8:23 PM ^
November 3rd, 2017 at 11:51 AM ^
It's impressive for the MLS, but says more about their growth than anything bad about the NHL or NBA. The MLS plays fewer games (scarcity, season tickets cost less) and has larger stadiums (higher ceiling). A league that averages 21,000 in attendance is always going to have higher numbers than hockey and basketball leagues where facility sizes dictate that averaging 21,000 is physically impossible even if every game is a sellout.
November 2nd, 2017 at 9:12 PM ^
November 2nd, 2017 at 9:14 PM ^
Never in my life would I have thought that soccer would have an audience there. But that atmosphere in Cincy for the game vs Chicago and the attendance figures in Atlanta this year..you know it makes you wonder I've always been a 'soccer will never work in America' guy, but I think I might have been wrong. I think the times have changed.
Now soccer isn't where they will draw NFL or major college football level crowds - heck even in Europe only a dozen or so clubs draw those crowds week-in week-out - but MLS is aiming for a 20k-30k type attendance and they seem to be near that or already there in a number of markets.
I do think they should build a stadium rather than use a NFL stadium. Use of the NFL stadium isn't economical if you can only fill it 1/3.
November 3rd, 2017 at 8:25 AM ^
I am stunned by their passion and turn out. Huge crowds in their first year. I have seen a few of their games and it is not lots of little kids getting free tickets. Mostly adults who are screaming their heads off ( I could only imagine if that team had some world class talent). Impressive.
November 3rd, 2017 at 11:54 AM ^
I'm not a huge MLS fan or anything, but I was convinced that they have found their niche when I flipped on a Portland-Seattle game in Portland a few years ago and saw the atmosphere. Portland was bad that year and I recognized only a handful of the players, but the crowd made it clear that the game was a big deal and I was transfixed.
November 2nd, 2017 at 10:11 PM ^
That's the only reason to explain why they can't get anything built there. Antoine Cadillac must've desecrated some graves there...and wherever the Lions call home.
November 3rd, 2017 at 1:20 AM ^
Is there really a market for soccer in Detroit? I haven't been home in ages, but how big has Mexicantown gotten? If I lived in the area I'd be all over this!
November 3rd, 2017 at 12:17 PM ^
November 3rd, 2017 at 3:29 PM ^
MLS has helped out Panama and Hoinduras national teams more than the US in terms of development
November 3rd, 2017 at 3:32 PM ^
As for the bid, gonna need alot of money behind it to convince MLS on this.
you think with gores and gilbert and the fords it would be a non brainer , but guess we shall see