Michigan-Belleville problems cost us 5 star Damon Payne
According to Sam on the Inside Michigan Recruiting podcast latest episode, the tension between the coaches from Michigan and Belleville “for sure” has had a negative effect on Damon Payne’s recruitment and is why he is leaving MI to play college football.
Payne is a 5 star #1 DT nationally, #1 player in MI. Consensus seems to be that he’s heading down South but OSU is listed as warm on his 247 profile.
Trying to spin 5th round draft picks as being more impressive than top 10 draft picks is absurd.
There's not a teenage kid in the country who sees Glasgow and Danna as more encouraging stories of success than Young and Okudah. Only people who are deep into Michigan football even know who the Glasgows and Danna are. Young and Okudah are national stars among the best at their positions in the country.
The best high school players know they're going to the NFL, in that aspect Michigan isn't providing anything that Alabama, Clemson, and Ohio State can't. But obviously those schools can provide something Michigan can't. Why not prepare for the NFL and play in the playoff and perhaps win the National Championship? And yes, probably get paid as well. Michigan can't compete with that until they start winning big games.
This is some sad shit. Go get help you fucking loser.
Seems like a lot of projection on you're part Magnus. Hes not wrong.
When it comes to the big games Michigan has disappointed for over 10 years now.
You really think that Harbaughs bowl record at Michigan and the beat downs against OSU have no effect on recruits interest? Give us a break...
Also in 2020 almost every college around the country has incredible football facilities these days.
You’re right. I take it all back. There’s no reason to go to Michigan.
All these kids choosing Michigan are maroons making this silly choice randomly without any logic.
3 minutes of internet research would have led you to 8 defensive linemen drafted in the past 5 years.
8 DL drafted sure, how many has OSU had and they actually win things on the field?
edit: OSU has had 10
OSU has had 10 with much better prospects while Michigan has had 8 with much fewer elite prospects. So I could technically argue that Michigan is perhaps better at developing DL talent.
So why aren't the better prospects coming here then with our track record?
Probably because negative Nancys like you post on this blog
Yet, we lost the guy who developed most of those guys...to OSU. Traitor Greg
You could argue that but you would lose the argument. Larry Johnson is probably the best position coach in the country. Sure the 5* guys pan out, but so do the 3* guys like DeVon Hamilton.
The question was, what sells an elite DT on Michigan? I replied that we have had 8 defensive linemen drafted in 5 years. So there are 8 selling points.
The question was not why would an elite DT go to Michigan over Ohio State?
My point is our staff has proven they can get defensive lineman to the NFL, and they have done it with walk-ons and 5 stars.
To be fair, technically there is plenty to sell on for Michigan. Brown has put plenty of guys into the league since he got here, and then if nothing else, you fall back on the education.
But I do agree in the sentiment you're making that if I'm looking strictly at on-field selling points, OSU, Alabama, and Clemson have much more to sell right now. That's not being a Debbie Downer or a troll. That's just factual. Michigan hasn't won anything that really matters on the national stage in over a decade. OSU has consistently reminded the college football world every November just how far behind Michigan is from the true heavyweights.
If I'm the #1 DT in America, and I'm impartial (i.e. didn't grow up a Michigan or OSU fan), I definitely at least consider Michigan. I give them the chance to get me in the door and sell me because it is a world-renowned university. But if my goal is strictly to win national titles and get prepared to get drafted in the NFL, I'm probably going somewhere else.
I know this is a Michigan fanboy message board--but education, shmeducation.
A degree is a degree.
What's so great about sitting at Michigan being taught by a TA and trying to ignore the snoring of 250 hung over idiots while trying to keep yourself from barfing after another night of Beer Pong?
It keeps popping up on this board, but the "great degree" thing is the trope of every fanboy who pretends to go to the school they post for, and it really doesn't matter to someone from Missouri, Kentucky, or any other state with their own over priced, inflated sense of value degree.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. I didn't go to Michigan. I had neither the money nor the grades to do so. And I agree a degree is a degree. But universities like Michigan and Stanford and Northwestern are not just universities. They are some of the best in the world, with top people in numerous fields of study.
I understand most of these athletes won't be in those fields, but they may be in associated fields, and the networking alone is worth every penny. And athletes are generally extroverted, have great leadership skills and exude self-confidence. Just having those connections and those traits almost guarantees them a job for life, anywhere in the world.
I'm not sure how much of a difference that makes in a 5 star, but it should make a difference in those who aren't.
That's fine, but the majority of Michigan grads, unless they got major scholarships, will be on the same student loan path and average income as the rest of people who go to college anywhere else. I didn't even make a 3.0 gpa at Toledo and I got hired over 300 other applicants at an engineering firm in metro Detroit where the majority of people there were from UM or MSU. I got hired by setting myself apart by stopping over and introducing myself one day. I didn't end up liking the job and left after a week.
This girl isn't the only one.
Maybe things have changed since the early 80s, but that description has zero in common with my Michigan experience. Plus a large alum network opens doors. Guess that take makes me a fanboy.
And when it comes to five star NFL talent, the degree is rarely the endgame. Most are looking at NFL prep and national exposure.
This guy joined yesterday and he already has a long comment history that is completely trollish.
This is the lazy take of a person that does not have a degree from Michigan (being fully transparent, neither do I).
A degree from Michigan is not just the experience you get in the classroom. Far more impactful is the access to more prominent and influential positions and networks of people because you received a degree from UofM. The degree represents access - just as much as, and because of - the excellent academic institution that stands behind it.
It doesn't take a Michigan grad to understand the impact of what a UM degree represents, and I am fairly certain that you already know that.
Well, Sparty on then dude.
Kind of hard to "start winning big games" without the talent of a Damon Payne. How do you suppose they win with no talent? If they don't have it in place, they won't win those games you talk about, therefore continuing to put themselves in the same cycle. Not that that's what Michigan's problems are but just pointing out a problem with your gripe.
I don’t agree with you that there is no reason an elite recruit from Michigan wouldn’t want to come here. BUT, a recruit from Michigan who wants to go to the warm weather, be treated like a Star in Baton Rouge or Tuscaloosa, where there are many less hurdles (academic, etc) on your path to the NFL is a great option. I do wish he would play for us but I do not blame him for wanting to go somewhere completely new for a college experience. If the Harbaugh/Belleville situation did play any part in his decision though, that does need to be rectified by Harbaugh. We already have enough geographic recruiting disadvantages, we don’t need someone in our own backyard with an axe to grind.
ER Doc CRUSHED this one!
Michigan is an elite school, with elite athletic facilities, elite academics, elite networks of alum. Every year multiple football players from Michigan go on to the NFL.
However - if a player values something more than he values the Michigan Experience, whatever that may be, that's his prerogative.
BUT - as Doc said, if some petty feud between the Michigan coaching staff and an area HS staff is playing any role in steering these kids' decisions, that needs to be fixed asap, by Michigan! As he so aptly said, we don't need any more obstacles!
Every year multiple football players from Michigan go on to the NFL.
What if they want to be a high draft pick?
The can talk to Ruiz, Uche, Peppers, Bush, Gary, Long, and people like that who were relatively high draft picks.
Michigan proves the stage, your play decides where you're picked.
Same way Michael Thomas was as high draft pick... the OSU WRs this year weren't picked over Glasgow.
Zeke was a high draft pick. Weber was not.
Ummm... David Long was not a high draft pick. Michigan has produced one fringe first rounder from offense. Offensive skill position players do not get developed at Michigan. They come in decent and leave decent.
Well holy shit....
A.) Thanks for the -44 down votes. Maybe a personal record.
2.) Glad my two sentence comment turned into what it did.
C.) "Sampson Simpson, I stick by my story!"
No way. A bunch of mgodudes told me very clearly that this feud didn’t matter.
When's that shuttle thingy supposed to land on the moon?
"Who'd they play at DT last year? Oh, Ben Mason and Jessie Speight? Yeah I think I'm gonna go South."
I for one have faith in the staff. I am proud to be a Michigan fan and proud of every single player to ever wear the winged helmet.
Disgraceful that folks would downvote tcrew's comment. A +1 from me, my friend!
I do not know the history of the Belleville / Harbaugh tension, could someone kindly recap it?
A few years ago when we would miss out on in-state recruits, the comments were often, and correctly so, that the state of Michigan was having a down year for HS football talent. However, it seems that the quality of our state's recruits has gotten better recently, at least the top tier, and we are still missing out on them, very sad!
There's only uncorroborated rumors. But I'll tell you the super short version of the prevailing story.
Belleville coach didn't care for Harbaugh/Michigan in the first place.
Harbaugh made comment to Michigan players that he thought Belleville was disorganized/sloppy.
Belleville coach heard about it and steers kids away from Michigan.
I’ve said it before, whatever the problems are with with Belleville, Harbaugh needs to fix it. I don’t care who is right, who’s ego got in the way or who started it, fix the damn problem. They have too much talent to allow a long running feud to hamper recruiting efforts. Make a trip to Bville, invite them to UM and do what it takes to make peace.
He tried this, then he sent Nua to patch things up. It appears that didn’t work either because Sam is saying they have basically stopped recruiting Belleville unless there is a kid that wants to hear from Michigan and their coach is not involved. This strikes me as bad for Belleville, not bad for Michigan.
Can someone point me to all this talent Michigan has missed out on that was from Belleville?
The Belleville coach is a sparty grad. He does not like Michigan period and will sway his players not to go to Michigan.
While true that he is currently steering players away from Michigan, the guy grew up a huge Michigan fan.
Julian Barnett and Devontae Dobbs went to MSU in 2019, Andre Seldon is obviously a Michigan player, then in 2021 there is Damon Payne and Jamari Buddin
So 3 top-100 players and then we recruited over Buddin
Nua?? No disrespect but if you want to fix a beef you don’t send Nua, you send Brown, Gattis and/or Harbaugh. It’s not just about what Belleville can offer, it’s the mindset of putting a fence around your own state. If you struggle to keep the elite talent in state, you need a different strategy. This isn’t about one player or one school. Recruit nationally but own your state and then branch out. That strategy seemed to work out ok for the scumbags in Ohio. After a couple of big setbacks they don’t lose the elite in state players any longer and that wasn’t a urban move, Tressel built the framework. We are in Michigan and lose elite in state talent and get zero signees from OH every other year. If you don’t see the problem with that so be it
Why Michigan doesn't recruit (or recruit hard enough) in Ohio is beyond me. There are a lot of really good players from Ohio who don't play for Ohio State.
Nua?? No disrespect but if you want to fix a beef you don’t send Nua, you send Brown, Gattis and/or Harbaugh. It’s not just about what Belleville can offer, it’s the mindset of putting a fence around your own state. If you struggle to keep the elite talent in state, you need a different strategy. This isn’t about one player or one school. Recruit nationally but own your state and then branch out. That strategy seemed to work out ok for the scumbags in Ohio. After a couple of big setbacks they don’t lose the elite in state players any longer and that wasn’t a urban move, Tressel built the framework. We are in Michigan and lose elite in state talent and get zero signees from OH every other year. If you don’t see the problem with that so be it
And fwiw a friend of mine is a Belleville alum and agrees with harbaugh. Said the coach gets too friendly with players and let’s them do their own thing which led to them being upset in the playoffs recently?
Don’t know the full playoff story as I’m not from the area but figured that tidbit was worth posting here.
Seems pretty lame or petty either way. So a kid isnt even looking at a school right down the street when it may actually check all the boxes. That just dumb.
How do we convince IMG Academy to offer him for his senior year?
Again???
Honestly, WD? This horse? The quarantine process is taking its toll! I thought Scott came back to visit us. This is the 1,000,000th post about the same $&!?
Honestly, WD? This horse? The quarantine process is taking its toll! I thought Scott came back to visit us. This is the 1,000,000th post about the same $&!?