It's Meltdown Time! Michigan Ag front and center

Submitted by yossarians tree on September 21st, 2022 at 10:01 AM

Typically, the MSU comments are colorless and uninspired, but like cold pizza you enjoy it anyway.

Was struck by this comment from Miami fans: "I hope Gattis changes this running up to the line only to stop and look to the sidelines until there’s 6-8 seconds left then rush and try and get a play off…shit is stupid." Well, well, well...

https://www.rollbamaroll.com/2022/9/21/23363179/nsfw-its-meltdown-time-maybe-mario-cristobal-mel-tucker-werent-worth-100-million-after-all

lilpenny1316

September 21st, 2022 at 10:12 AM ^

I hope Gattis is successful, but I will always wonder if his WR recruiting success is what kept him here. "Speed in Space" was retired with "Michigan Man" when he left and our offense looks better than anything I've seen since the Moeller teams.

 

 

HarmonHowardWoodson

September 21st, 2022 at 10:18 AM ^

I think our offense is so explosive, in part, because we are getting it to our speedy guys...wait for it...with space to make something happen. We have seen some great successes with our short passing game turning into big plays, especially from Roman Wilson. Maybe Gattis wasn't the greatest at executing his concepts, or maybe he was limited by personnel, but the concept of speed in space is one that all offensive coordinators should dream about. 

Personally, I think this is where JJ has impressed me most in his first two starts. He is hitting guys in a spot that gives them a chance to turn up field. This is especially true and important on throws to the flat and drag routes. Anything close to the line of scrimmage needs an accurate throw so that 4 air yards can turn into an 8 or 10 yard gain (or more).

DennisFranklinDaMan

September 21st, 2022 at 12:39 PM ^

I actually agree with you re Cade, at least with deep passes, but ... the way you express it sounds a bit dismissive of him. In fact, we had a damned good offense last year (second in the Big Ten in offense, and second in fewest turnovers per game, each time behind only Ohio State), and he did a lot of things well. Limiting turnovers while leading a team to victory is not to be dismissed. 

I'm on Team JJ, no doubt, but Cade did a hell of a job last year.

Robbie Moore

September 21st, 2022 at 11:08 AM ^

Dumbass career move. Going from a team that went to the Playoffs and was absolutely loaded on offense to the third school in Florida where nobody has cared about U football since 2001. Whose last 5 coaches were Cristobol, Manny Diaz, semi-retired Mark Richt, Al Golden and Randy Shannon.

I'm beginning to think that Gattis got the firm handshake and Harbaugh wasn't the least bit surprised when Gattis departed. 

goblu330

September 21st, 2022 at 11:37 AM ^

I don't really think we can evaluate the move without knowing what Harbaugh had told him regarding his plan.  True, Miami as OC is not the best spot, but there are like 6 legit(ish) college football programs in Florida if you include Central and South Florida that cycle through coaches almost annually.  If he just needed a spot to land because he believed changes were coming to Michigan it is not the worst he could have done.  Somebody down there is bound to offer him a shot just because they need a dude.

Grampy

September 21st, 2022 at 1:06 PM ^

I don’t know if the old ‘firm handshake’ was involved, but it’s pretty clear that Gattis read his press clippings and felt disrespected that he (apparently) wasn’t a shoo-in for the job if Harbaugh left. Given how slim the results were during his tenure here, maybe he could have been more circumspect in his reaction. Seeing the same problems with Miami’s offense this year isn’t a good look for him. 

jmblue

September 21st, 2022 at 1:35 PM ^

I don't think it was a firm handshake, unless there was something to those seedy recruiting rumors.  Football-wise, there wasn't a reason to let him go.  I think it was just understood from the time he was hired that he was probably only going to be here a few years, so Harbaugh was ready to move on if it happened.  

TeslaRedVictorBlue

September 21st, 2022 at 10:33 AM ^

Lets not list "wasted" talent. We don't have that kind of time...  Nico was awesome. Sad we never had a great QB to use him, and that we insisted on running into the line 900 times a game (often unsuccessfully) instead of tossing it up to him.

We have an abundance of WR talent right now. Anthony, who is a pretty dynamic player.. doesnt get a whiff. The freshman probably will shrink back now, without much plan.

Bell, All, Schoooon, Wilson (who I like the most), are the primary targets. But this offense doesn't put up gaudy numbers even when we score 59 pts, somehow. So, in terms of wasting, I don't think that's what we're doing, but we aren't quite developing that elite skill position talent. We are putting guys in a system that has and hopefully continues to be successful at the college level.

LeCheezus

September 21st, 2022 at 10:49 AM ^

We didn't put up gaudy numbers scoring 59 points because in the "competitive" portion of the game, we had:

- A fumble recovered on opponent 18 yard line (only got FG, but still only 18 yards available)

- A punt return touchdown (zero offensive yards)

- A blocked punt returned to opponent 18 yard line

- On top of the above, UConn couldn't move the ball so half of our other scoring possessions started with short fields

Then Davis Warren was in before the 4th quarter.  Bell and Schoonmaker also got tacked at the 1 yard line so TD receptions could have easily been 2 instead of zero.

That being said, I partially agree with your overall sentiment - preseason predictions that this would be some crazy high functioning spread passing attack were a bit too optimistic given who the coaching staff is (an too pessimistic about the defense).  Still hard to draw many conclusions though when you've done just about all that is possible beating up 3 tomato cans.

The Oracle 2

September 21st, 2022 at 4:47 PM ^

I also wonder if the way Michigan has conducted the passing game under Harbaugh, at least to this point, affects the way receiver recruits look at Michigan. The most yards any receiver has gained in a season since Harbaugh arrived is still the 862 Darboh had in 2015. Chesson’s 9 TDS the same year were also the most in the Harbaugh era. Michigan has thrown less than other top schools and spreads the catches around. I’m wondering if that will change at all over the next two years with McCarthy at QB.

The other side of it is the players themselves. Who’s the best skill position player Michigan has had since Harbaugh arrived? I think it might’ve been 2021 Haskins, but I believe it’s fair to say that while they’ve had some very good players on offense, I don’t think they’ve had a single great player. But I also think that’s about to change.

UMForLife

September 21st, 2022 at 10:53 AM ^

Have to agree. I will add that Harbaugh made a great move by bringing in an analyst who he happened to move to Co-OC this year. And suddenly, the offense has been humming and you saw the signs last year. So, Gattis probably had some hand in it, but I think Harbaugh and analyst made things happen as well last year. This year is a different level.

ex dx dy

September 21st, 2022 at 12:49 PM ^

My read of Gattis is that he's an idea man. He's personable, relatable, has great ideas, and knows how to sell them. Unfortunately, I don't think he knows how to implement them well. If he were in the business world, he'd be the Tech Bro that effortlessly gets millions in venture capital with a captivating vision, but is never able to get the business off the ground. In football, he's a great recruiter with good ideas that never quite come together into a coherent offense. These kinds of people can succeed, but only if they recognize they need help in implementation. Based on the comments we've seen from Gattis, I'm not optimistic he has that level of self-awareness and humility.

ChuckieWoodson

September 21st, 2022 at 10:17 AM ^

I think MSU is still a bit dangerous and should not be overlooked, but man their defensive backfield is a shit show.  They're certainly better against the run but watching the W game the run D didn't look that great, either.  They fought back after getting down early and Thorne is a pretty decent QB... they still have a pulse but we need to destroy them this year. 

bronxblue

September 21st, 2022 at 3:22 PM ^

Yeah, "always going for it" sounds great when you're playing Madden but in terms of game theory trying to convert on 4th down on your own 24 with about a quarter to go is a bad idea and cost them in this game. And some of their 4th-down conversions in this game were dumb as well; they scored 2 TDs on 4th down plays, one after a botched snap turned into a fumble but was overturned because they illegally snapped the ball to start off.  This was a game where a ton of breaks went MSU's way and they still lost by double digits.

Tucker seems to have more Hoke in him than MSU wants to admit, and it shows with some boneheaded playcalls that look "ballsy" when they work and dumb when they don't.  He's a good coach and is better than late-stage Dantonio but if he sticks around at MSU for the length of his contract I think he's going to turn into a .500 coach and fail to really build anything of substance.

King Tot

September 21st, 2022 at 11:29 AM ^

Maybe it was the travel but those transfer RBs/OL looked like complete trash against UW. They kept trying and putting themselves in 2nd/3rd and long. 

They also did not look good stopping the run most of the game. They were missing maybe their best defensive player in Jacob Slade (X. Henderson was also out)