HighBeta

July 15th, 2022 at 8:35 PM ^

IIRC, the kid had a great senior year for us. He played a role in Don Brown's 2016 successes. Nice!

Happy for the him and his chance at success.

WestQuad

July 16th, 2022 at 11:01 AM ^

I agree that that Indian team mascots, especially Cleveland, were racist non-positive images.  It is a little disappointing though that no one was able to come up with a positive team image.  The Vikings, 49ers, Buccaneers, Oilers, Texans, Mariners, etc. all seem to work and not offend anyone. There were a lot of badasses in native american history.  Tecumseh, Geronimo, etc.   I guess people fighting genocide is hard to paint as a positive. 

 

I tried using Open AI to generate some non-offensive names and this is what it came up with:

 

1. The Arrowheads 2. The Tomahawks 3. The Braves 4. The Chiefs 5. The Indians 6. The Seminoles 7. The Sioux 8. The Apaches 9. The Mohicans 10. The Iroquois

1. Washakie Ten 2. Findley warriors 3. Papago Braves 4. Seminole Tomahawks 5. Chippewa Champs 6. Osage Nationals 7. Iroquois All-Stars 8. Huron Heat

 

RAH

July 16th, 2022 at 11:15 AM ^

I think that you will have a hard time finding any name that won't offend those who are poised to be offended. Note that most of those perpetually offended are not Native Americans but white. Some time ago the Washington Post did a poll and the results indicated that the clear majority of Native Americans don't really care.

bronxblue

July 16th, 2022 at 12:52 PM ^

This isn't the point of this post - Stribling getting a shot in the NFL is and I'm happy for him - but I have seen this Washington Post poll used a bunch of times to dismiss actual complaints and offensiveness of these various mascots and names, and so I wanted to push back.

The original Washington Post poll wasn't specifically about Native American respondent's views on mascots; they were parts of broader surveys the Post did that, when they had an NA respondent on the line, would be asked a couple of questions.  The 504 respondents were surveyed over something like 4 months of other surveys, so we're already getting into sampling and timing issues that weaken the overall findings.  Beyond that, some of the questions were then asked of even fewer respondents (340 were asked about general offensiveness), and again that's spread out over the same broad time range.  Plus, since these were all phone surveys you also need to account for the known bias of respondents to provide "more socially desirable responses" when speaking to someone on the phone.  And there have been contemporaneous studies showing that these mascots and names do lower self-respect amongst Native Americans, to say nothing of the numerous Native American organizations that have (and continue to) speak out about the use of offensive mascot names both at the professional and amateur levels.

But beyond all that, I don't know why it is so hard for people to just change a name.  Whether or not Cleveland or Washington "meant" to be offensive (and considering the views held by non-NA society at the times these names were first attached to those teams it's hard to claim they were positive), the fact that numerous groups of actual Native Americans petitioned to change the names sure seems to carry more weight than a handful of somewhat dubious surveys.  As noted above, there are voluminous examples of non-offensive names that could have been selected and yet people doggedly defended Daniel fucking Snyder's right to keep this dumb name seemingly because they didn't want to update their jersey collection.  Guardians and Commanders are uninspiring names, but blame that on well-compensated-but-uncreative consultants who, somewhat ironically, relied HEAVILY on public polls to identify the two "best" names for these sports teams.

MichiganiaMan

July 20th, 2022 at 6:10 PM ^

As someone connected w/ my indigenous heritage and enrolled in my tribe, I’m always torn on this. The new names often suck and the unintentional consequences of these changes is further erasure of our culture in the American consciousness.

I personally wish all teams in question reverted to some sort of common identity that didn’t just try to paper over the foul histories. Ideally no mascot at all and just adopting the naming conventions of the Euro soccer clubs.

1VaBlue1

July 16th, 2022 at 8:24 AM ^

Good luck to him!  Although the Commanders should have kept the name "WFT", it makes perfect sense for Dan Snyder.  I have zero doubts that he named it that to fuck with people, because he didn't want to change the name at all.  And he's a first class asshole.