OT: Big 12 looking at Memphis and Houston for expansion
I could say "reportedly" since ESPN claims to have the documents proving this outreach and I have not seen a reply from the Big 12, but it all seems pretty detailed. Old Gordon Gee is in the middle of the activity including a trip to Houston to check out facilities.
So, when will we be the B1G 16?
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/15502359/documents-show-…
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than adding mid-majors. There is a negative upside since they would never, ever bring in as much revenue as they take out. There is an additional downside of limiting your possibillities when the Big XII implodes. One can hate on Delaney for his moves, but they all made sense in terms of revenue, his biggest concern.
so why did they add rutgers then? Did you forget the big (L)east lost its autobid? The conferences have proven in the last 10-15 years it's all about $. Really i'd say that's true since at least the first acc expansion. Kind of blows my mind why they'd add houston then. Is adding a 5th-6th texas team really going to add value to their expected network, compared to cinncy or ucf?
It surely wasn't before the Big Ten announced it was adding Rutgers. I've said below, I think there is very little chance that the Big XII will add Houston. Unless they are adding six teams, I don't see it.
Actually, their business school has several programs ranked in the top 15 including their Taxation program at #1. Nebraska can't match that.
The rest of the university... ugghh.
The medical school's pretty good. Nursing and pharmacy, too. Music.
And the criminal justice grad program is #3 in the country.
I agree about the general quality of the school--they aren't as selective as a typical B1G school. I took some math there during my last year of high school and I wasn't too impressed with the quality of the teaching, or the students in my class. (Very small sample size, I know.) But they've got their strengths.
As you said, UC has its strengths.
At an overall level, UC is a step below the typical B1G institution. But they're at the same overall level as schools like Kentucky, Tennessee, Arkansas, K-State, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, et cetera. Fairly big public universities that are a definite step-above regional institutions but a step-below AAU-level.
Are out in force, googling university stuff to pretend to know about university stuff.
As usual, a group of people who've never gone to college comment on college.
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But they'd be solidly in the middle of the B12, and better than any school under consideration other than UConn.
I guess I was responding to "Ugh." It doesn't deserve that. (Well, maybe the campus does--it's one big under-construction parking lot.)
Hard pass.
If we do expand there are far better choices athletically than Cincy, and they're not in the AAU. Not every choice should be made on the basis of "what might anger OSU the most?"
ground throwing a tantrum. Maybe we can suggest it without being serious about doing it.
"Not every choice should be made on the basis of 'what might anger OSU the most?'"
Why not? It sounds like a perfect decision-making process to me.
Yet we invited Nebraska knowing damn well they would be expelled from the AAU! They were nearly ousted ten years earlier and had done nothing to remedy the issues.
What don't I understand? You're saying the same thing I did. Nebraska narrowly avoided having their eligibility voted on in 2000. The B1G presidents knew this going in. Hell, Wisconsin and Michigan were largely responsible for their ouster. MSC voted to eliminate them. If their medical center was in Lincoln this would probably be a moot point and they would still be AAU members.
Wow! First double post ever!
upvote for both.
Gee (not Gordon), thanks!
I feel like these expansion talks are often driven by who is in last year's top 25 for CFB. Memphis and Houston are flash in the pan success stories. Memphis will now go back to being a nobody bc they lost their coach; and Houston will lose theirs as soon as some desperate SEC program forks over a vault to buy him out.
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I agree about the top 25 thing, but in this case I think that's why Houston and Memphis made the ESPN headline, not necessary why they're being considered. If you read the article, it's actually about four schools under consideration: Houston, Memphis, UCF, and Colorado State.
Cincinnati doesn't need to send a brochure now and nobody from the conference needs to tour their facilities--they were at that stage a year ago. Nothing's happened to suggest they're not still being considered; most of what I see still has them at the top of the list.
and 1 school to the West. But having one school east HAS to be a priority. WVU is definitely out there isolated right now.
Viable schools for expansion "east of the Mississippi" --- Cincinnati, Connecticut, Memphis (technically east of the River), Temple, and the UCF/USF Florida twins.
Ask WVU their preference among those 6: I think Cincinnati ranks #1, followed by the 2 Florida schools (in some order), then Connecticut, Temple, Memphis.
Ask the rest of the Big XII their preference among those 6: I think they rank Cincinnati dead even with the Florida schools (followed by everyone else). They could go either way. The Northern Big XII schools are closer to Ohio; the Southern Big XII schools are closer to Florida. Ohio and Florida are both valuable states to have exposure in.
I don't know about the Western school they pick, but I can't imagine a scenario where at least one of Cincinnati/UCF don't get invited (if there is expansion).
...is that when the Big 12 holds a vote, Texas's vote counts ten and each of the other schools counts one each. They're currently opposed to expansion, which means they've got an effective veto on any school that's proposed.
I'm pretty sure that at the end of the day it will be (1) Cincinnati and (2) whichever other school Texas chooses. And that there will be a formula that deprives the new additions of full revenue sharing.
i'm sure texas fans would be thrilled playing cincinnati and memphis every year instead of a&m nebraska mizzou, but i guess their wishes mean nothing compared to the 'precious' LHN
and UNLV. That's my guess of the order they would have them. UNLV would be an intriguing choice, similar to UCF based on potential.
I don't know if I'd say they are similiar to UCF based upon potential. I'd put UCF well ahead of UNLV in regards to the potential of one being a good football program because UCF is in one of the most fertile states for high school football, not to mention they are surrounded by the other southern states.
UNLV brings in a pretty big market. They're investing in a new football stadium. If they can turn that program around, they'll also be a bigger TV draw than a directional Florida school beyond their local market.
While UCF probably has the easier path to building a strong football program and opens up recruiting in a fertile area, UNLV has more potential to contribute financially.
This is just done off of Google maps but:
Dallas to Orland is 1084 miles
Dallas to Cincy is 934 miles.
but you are absolutely right.
As the bird flies (air mileage), Cincinnati is also ~ 5% closer to Austin than Orlando.
My sense is that neither of those schools is an academic powerhouse, and while the Big 12 is not often mistaken for the Ivy League, this would seemingly lower the overall academic prestige of the conference.
It's not my problem, but is a playoff worth dragging down the prestige of the other member schools? (Semi-rhetorical question, that.)
More and more it seems clear that the 'academic pedigree' side of things just doesn't matter. How does both MD and Rutgers fit academically with the other B1G schools? (Seriously - I don't know.) Expansion today is more about money - TV markets first, other forms of revenue generation second, recruiting third.
My memory is that Maryland is pretty good, and Rutgers is decidedly "meh". The real straggler, from what I recall, was Nebraska - where the "N" is for "knowledge"!*
I recall that admitting Nebraska was a matter of serious debate at the time, and the debate was on academic measures. It was something about AAU accreditation, or some such. As you say, these concerns all seem to be fading into the background.
*Yes, I realize Bob Kerrey was joking when he said this. It's still funny.
honestly it should not. This is an athletic conference. The ivy league itself is an athletic conference. No one mistook UM with iowa academically, no one mistakes HYP with brown. Rarely do applications coincide, and when students and researchers do collaborate and compete with other colleges, the conference their football team belongs to is rarely a factor
Not surprised, rumors abound forever because they want a Championship Game. All the cool kids have a Championship Game, you know. And if this is spurring the next round of expansion, well, okay. I want to say the B1G will be okay because one thing Delany can do is maximize profit. But his choices are suspect - MD and Rutgers. Okay, not 'suspect', HORRIBLE (especially Rutgers).
I'd like to trade Pointy Haired Boss and Rutgers for Houston and an expansion pick to be named later...
is not the reason for expansion. The Big 12 is now allowed to hold a championship game with 10 members. I believe a primary motivation for expansion at this point is the increased probability of earning a bid into the playoff if the conference plays a chamionship game, adds two members, and only plays eight conference games. Basically, the confrence recently had a research firm tell them there is a better way of getting into the playoff than using the "one true champion" route.
I think Houston is a pretty good fit from a geographical/athletic standpoint, but Memphis doesnt make much sense to me. They arent great in either football/basketball but I guess you would have that Memphis/Nashville market.
Practically no one in the Big XII wants more Texas schools. I would be shocked if Houston and Memphis are on the top of their wish list. They are just doing their due diligence. If they are considering adding six more schools, then maybe they get in.
The Memphis market, sure, the Nashville market, decidedly not, no-one in Nashville gives two damns about Memphis and the energy here is all SEC and to a lesser extent Big Ten due to the transplants.
than Rutgers and Maryland, so haha!
Houston is not worse than Rutgers.