Copying OSU on punt returns

Submitted by ck4um on

I saw that Trent is our punt return guy this year and that got me thinking - what if we did what OSU did a few years back and have two guys receiving punts.

It always worried me to see Ginn and Holmes receiving punts because both were explosive and good return men.  I like Trent, but what about tossing in one of the freshmen RBs or WRs back there as well?  

What do you guys think?

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mjv

August 25th, 2008 at 2:09 PM ^

Having the extra return man opens some options on running reverses and fake reverses, but it seems to me that effective blocking of the other teams gunners is the best way to enhance a punt return. 

The idea of putting someone back with Ginn may have been to mitigate the opponents ability to directionally kick away from the return man.

I'll wait to see how Trent performs before commenting on the approach.  (I have not seen a depth chart or the like indicating Trent will be returning kicks.  Is there a link?)

Wild Speculation:  Is it likely that having Trent on punt return indicates that Boubacar Cissoko is performing well enough in camp that the theoretical injury risk of having the #1 corner on punt return is mitigated?

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mjv

August 25th, 2008 at 3:49 PM ^

4.13 was probably hand timed.  Electronically was probably a more conservative 4.16. 

Kidding aside.  I assumed Trent is #1 given he is a senior vs a soph.  Nothing more.

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Kal

August 25th, 2008 at 4:15 PM ^

I don't know how you took either posts in this thread about the 4.13 speed seriously. Read them again, but this time look at the context of the posts. They were both kidding, hence the silly emoticon in the post that brought it up and the "KIDDING ASIDE" in mjvan's post.

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ShockFX

August 25th, 2008 at 5:26 PM ^

Personally I think we are not too deep at DB, and don't think our top 3 DBs should be the kick returners.  That's just me though.

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Jim Harbaugh S…

August 25th, 2008 at 5:40 PM ^

(IMO) are all about having the right guys back there - 

OSU's returns were awful last year I think they may have been ever worse than us. (Which is not surprising do to no Ginn - I think their only big play in the return game was the Ray Small punt return for a TD - which was called back.  It didn't matter though ,IIRC Beanie ran over 6 guys for a TD on the next play)

Mathews/minor were not the guys to return the ball - I trust RR is sending a gamechanger to field the kicks/punts. 

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Wonk

August 25th, 2008 at 6:56 PM ^

I think what it really comes down to is that anyone who can chase down a streaking Percy Harvin from 15 yards behind deserves his shot at returning punts. He gets two decent blocks on any given punt return, and he's got a shot to bust it open.

This is one year where RichRod cannot afford to say "Gee, he's the best man for the job, but let's hold him back because we don't want him overextended or hurt."

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Sommy

August 25th, 2008 at 7:15 PM ^

What baffles me is that I've heard plenty of people write off that Morgan Trent/Percy Harvin play because Trent caught him from an angle -- you know, as if the Pythagorean theorem is the devil's handiwork.

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ShockFX

August 25th, 2008 at 8:33 PM ^

I know.  I had a long ass argument with someone where they kept telling me I was stupid and didn't understand pursuit angles.  I'm like man, but he was BEHIND HIM you can never catch someone from behind unless you're faster.  Only to be dismissed with "dude, did you ever play linebacker? Then you don't know what you're talking about."

 Also in the vein, the Crable catching Ringer play.  Somehow he's slower even though he caught him at the goal line.  Proof that our educational system is failing at teaching math.

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Sommy

August 25th, 2008 at 9:05 PM ^

When kids learn to play, they're taught that the proper angle of pursuit ensures that they will have the shortest route to the ball carrier possible.  The problem is they somehow export that to mean "With the proper angle of pursuit, you won't have to run as far as the ball carrier!"

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Magnus

August 26th, 2008 at 7:15 PM ^

...putting Trent out there to return punts would not increase the risk he'd get hurt any more than putting him out there for an offensive play would.  The only time you usually see returners get hurt is when somebody nails them right when they're catching the ball, which is a rare occurrence.  And even then, it's usually more getting the wind knocked out of you than anything serious.

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mjv

August 27th, 2008 at 12:27 AM ^

Magnus, I agree that there seems to be little risk that a punt returner gets hurt.  The last time I can recall a Michigan punt returner getting hurt, it was Tripp Wellbourne against Minnesota in 1990.  (Of course, it basically ended his career.) 

Rather, I view the risk in this light.  If I as a coach felt that I had no depth behind a given player, in this case let's assume Trent, I would be more apprehensive to use him on special teams.  If there were only two workable corners, the possible 5 yards per punt improvement on a return (this is a number I grabbed out of my ass, but would seem to be an extreme increase from one return man to another) over 5-6 punts that get returned per game results in a total of 25-30 yards.  Putting an non-functional CB into a game is likely to result in 2 or 3 plays of 25-30 yards each.

Again, I agree that it is highly unlikely that a punt returner gets hurt, particularly if he is smart enough to use fair catches appropriately.  But depth at a particular position needs to be factored into the analysis.

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