MSU curses, the Satan Saban, and Dantonio’s Inferno
When I heard the cry of BCS injustice from QB Kirk Cousins. I was so concerned about his emotional distress that I sought to understand why MSU deserved a BCS Bowl game.
Maybe MSU was deserving because of all of its success in recent bowl games.
LOL
I checked it out. In their last 5 Bowl games under Dantonio, they are 0-5; in their last 6 bowl games, they are 0-6; essentally, they are zero-for-the-decade, when you consider their absence from any bowl for the other 4 years.
Unable to understand why MSU deserved a BCS bowl, I asked: what explained the MSU failures over the past decade?
Certainly, the failures could not be their fault…
LOL
Their failures must just be all bad luck. Remember 2010, when they lost out the Rose Bowl to Wisc—who they beat—and lost the other BCS bid to Ohio---which took MSUs possible spot in the Sugar Bowl with ineligible players, then vacated the game. Then. recall from 2011, the last-minute, game-deciding running into the kicker penalty in the B1G title game vs Wisc. Certainly, that penalty could not have been their fault. MSU players were incapable even of personal fouls. How could they possibly mount an assault on a helpless kicker? Maybe an MSU player was blocked into the Wisc kicker by an unseen, evil spirit.
LOL
And what could explain MSU’s absence from the BCS over its entire 13 years, in which no less than 8 B1G teams have gone to a BCS bowl?
Again, I checked it out. This seemingly interminable drought in MSU’s history corresponds with the departure of Nick Saban, who left MSU for LSU and now ALA. Since Saban left, the latter two teams have won multiple national titles—even playing each other for the title now-- yet MSU has not even been able to get to any BCS game at all.
So, is MSU haunted by the ghost of Nick Saban—or since he is alive—is Saban himself the devil? (note that his name is only one letter removed from “Satan”).
Witness the well-known curse, caused by the departure of Babe Ruth from the Red Sox. When Babe Ruth left the Red Sox for the Yankees just before 1920, the Sox had 5 World Series wins, the Yankees had none. But after that, the Yankees won 26 titles and the Red Sox failed to win a single title for almost 90 years. The Boston fans then ascribed their failure to a demon—the ghost of the Bambino. So, was MSU now suffering from the curse of Satan---I mean, Saban? MSU has not won a bowl game for 10 years, since they played in the seldom-attended and now-defunct Silicon Valley Classic.
LOL
But sadly, the Saban/Satan jinx could not alone explain the MSU’s sorry history. Looking back much further, we find that MSU actually has not played in or won a Rose Bowl in nearly a quarter of a century.
On the surface, that particular failure seems to be a clear-cut case of another curse: the SI cover jinx. Indeed, MichiganState has not appeared in a single Rose Bowl since their 1988 star, Tony Mandarich was featured on the cover of SI. On that cover, he was called the "best offensive line prospect ever." Mandarich weighed 304, ran the 40 in 4.65 sec, and bench pressed 225 pounds an unheard-of 39 times. Before the NFL Draft, he was called the “Incredible Bulk.” Yet, after being cut, he was called the “Incredible Bust." Having been drafted ahead of Barry Sanders, Andre Rison, and Neon Deon Sanders, MSU’s Mandarich became regarded as one of the 5 biggest busts in NFL history. And since then, MSU still has not appeared in a single Rose Bowl.
But were these failures a simple case of the SI jinx?
No. As I looked deeper into history, the story began to sound more like Faustian bargain: a deal made with a drug-peddling devil. Mandarich eventually revealed his longstanding abuse of drugs and steroids since his MSU days—in fact, faking a drug test before that fateful, last MSU Rose Bowl back in 1988. Moreover, he substantiated prior allegations that “steroid use was rampant among his teammates at Michigan State on that Rose Bowl team.”
Therefore, if we believe Mandarich, the last real, non-steroid-inspired Rose Bowl for MSU was over a half century ago--in fact, 54 years ago, in the days of Duffy Daugherty. That dought would be equalled by only one other B1G team (Minn).
But certainly, we can't tell Kirk Cousins that the fault for this epic failure lies with MSU. Should we then blame the failures on MSU players, who made a Faustian bargain and sold their souls to a drug-peddling Devil? Should we blame the SI jinx? Should we blame the departed coach, whose name sounds a lot like Satan?
I don’t know. I am ordinarily not a superstitious man. But we can tell Kirk Cousins that he is lucky he graduates. Pity those who must remain in East Lansing. What good can possibly come to them or to MSU, when the name of the current coach, Dantonio, sounds a lot like the author of Dante’s Inferno.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dante_%28Devil_May_Cry%29
http://listverse.com/2009/04/29/top-10-spooky-sports-curses/
December 6th, 2011 at 8:50 PM ^
lil bro. They can never be like us. They never will be us. They ALWAYS wish they were us.
December 6th, 2011 at 8:53 PM ^
With the "LOL" seperating every thought. Still interesting nonetheless.
December 6th, 2011 at 8:57 PM ^
Yes, although I gave him a pos.
.
Perhaps he should learn from
.
THE KNOWLEDGE
December 6th, 2011 at 11:22 PM ^
December 6th, 2011 at 9:06 PM ^
I can understand your annoyance by the LOLs. However, I found from past experience that I needed to signal the readers here that I was being sarcastic. In one thread, I noticed that a statement intended as sarcastic by John Borton was taken literally by about 90% of the readers posting here. I also noted that George Dohrman, the SI writer, used LOL to signal sarcasm in one of his messages. So, reluctantly, I decided to try it out.
If you have other ideas about how to avoid misinterpretation of the author's intent, I would be happy to hear them.
December 6th, 2011 at 9:47 PM ^
i assume on the model of html tags, which begin with the command text surrounded by <> (like <s>) and end with the same thing but with a / in front of the text (like </s>).
December 6th, 2011 at 9:14 PM ^
They should be replaced with #HALOLs!
December 6th, 2011 at 9:04 PM ^
So, let me get this straight. MSU didn't get a BCS bowl because they were bad under John L. Smith and Bobby Williams?
Looks like the Michigan arrogance is back, even after another humiliating beatdown at the hands of Little Brother. I suppose a Charmin-soft schedule will do wonders for a team mired in mediocrity, trying to resurrect the ghosts of a century ago. Reminds me of Notre Dame earlier this decade, as a matter of fact.
December 6th, 2011 at 9:11 PM ^
Reasonable discussion, and you're more than welcome here. Troll, and you'll be gone before anybody remembers your name.
Don't you have better things to do on a Tuesday night, or did your mom's basement just get internet access?
December 6th, 2011 at 9:46 PM ^
Why aren't you named KirksSecondRoseBowl?
December 6th, 2011 at 9:49 PM ^
Welcome to Earth. Here's a negbang to get you started.
December 6th, 2011 at 10:06 PM ^
Little known fact: 10 of the 12 opponents Michigan faced in 2011 are playing in bowl games. Not interested in revisiting Sparty's schedule, but I can assure you, their number is less than 10, as is the case with every other NCAA team. I understand the annoyance with apparent arrogance, and quite frankly the number of posts ripping Sparty on this site is over the top, but that "Charmin-soft schedule" argument is asinine, especially coming from another B1G school fan. The B1G is competitive intra-conference and any team can win week to week.
The fact that Iowa will get curb-stomped by Oklahoma four weeks after the regular season ends does not mean that Vandenburg, McNutt and Binns did not mark Nov 5 as the biggest game of the season and play up to the competition.
December 6th, 2011 at 11:56 PM ^
Youngstown State, Florida Atlantic, CMU.
A real murderer's row. 0 BCS conference and 3 1-A wins among them. /s
December 7th, 2011 at 11:29 AM ^
I noticed this very thing 2 days ago as well. If memory serves, I believe UM went 8-2 against bowl teams and MSU went 5-3. Enough said.
December 7th, 2011 at 5:13 PM ^
In a world where 6-6 guarantees you a bowl, "bowl team" means anything from Eastern Michigan to LSU. Under your rationale, your thrilling victory over Western Michigan at home is worth just as much as LSU's victory over Alabama in Tuscaloosa. Enough said, indeed.
December 7th, 2011 at 6:18 PM ^
Do they ring a bell. If you want thrilling look at Notre Dame and then the curb stomping of Nebraska. How did you do against them?
December 7th, 2011 at 7:17 PM ^
Ok....so, Iowa and the Michigan State game? Not to mention, you had both Nebraska and Notre Dame at home, along with no Wisconsin at all.
But hey, don't go changing the subject now. That was totally unrelated to the previous post. You still haven't answered me as to why your victory over Western Michigan was just as impressive a win as our victory over Wisconsin.
December 7th, 2011 at 2:07 AM ^
If UM's was "Charmin-soft", MSU's was "Cottonelle-soft" of something equally retarded and toilet paper related.
Your out of conference schedule was actually worse. And you lost one of those.
Your B1G schedule was harder, as we missed Wisconsin. But when they weren't on your field, they beat you. And Nebraska ate your lunch, but couldn't do shit against us.
You beat us. Congrats. You should be happy. Why aren't you?
December 7th, 2011 at 9:53 AM ^
Why should I be happy? The goal is not to beat UM. The goal is to make a Rose Bowl. We fell a hairsbreadth short of our goal this year, and it stings. But to see the bonanza of celebration over here for third place in the Big Ten is a little shocking, because that's not the UM program that I watched as a kid.
The OOC schedule argument is laughable. The way the system works, there's more difference between FAU and San Diego State than there is between Iowa State and LSU. In my mind, and I'm sure in yours too, one cupcake is just like another. Besides that, we played Notre Dame and Nebraska on the road, while you won at home. And the whole "common opponents" argument runs a little hollow due to both Iowa (which you conveniently left out) and the fact that we convincingly beat you head to head.
Look, I consider myself a fairly rational MSU fan. I've been a lurker here for awhile, because the college football news quality is quite good. But posts like this are just asinine. The reluctance to admit that MSU has a quality football team makes you guys look like you're pretty heavy in denial. And then to go read prognostications of "3+ touchdown win over SPARTY, MNC BERTH NEXT YEAR" makes me question the sanity of some fans.
December 7th, 2011 at 10:12 AM ^
The goal is not to beat UM. The goal is to make a Rose Bowl.The entire Spartan fan base does a damn good job of convincing us otherwise.
In my mind, and I'm sure in yours too, one cupcake is just like another.I know Sparties aren't fantastic at math, but tossing out numbers like this is a deliberate fallacy of equivocation. Nice try.
December 7th, 2011 at 12:38 PM ^
So you're saying you agree that the difference between playing FAU and playing Western is greater than the difference between playing Wisconsin twice and playing Illinois? Top this off with the necessary shot at MSU's academics (because people who obviously superior always need to remind themselves of it, right?) despite you not knowing anything about me personally, and you've got quite a statement there.
December 7th, 2011 at 11:49 AM ^
and yet you guys are the ones with RCMB.
December 7th, 2011 at 12:02 PM ^
The way the system works, there's more difference between FAU and San Diego State than there is between Iowa State and LSU.
Well, only one of those teams failed to make a bowl game this year (and nearly went 0-for-the-season), and it was the one MSU played in its OOC. So, no, they really are not the same.
December 7th, 2011 at 12:36 PM ^
doesn't indicate a call for rational debate.
You beat an Ohio State team missing 5 of its best players, and the Braxton Miller we saw at the end of the season was light years ahead of the confused pile of goo you played in week 5.
MSU played well this year, and the defense should be good again next year. You should be very, very happy based on historical performance of that program.
December 7th, 2011 at 12:48 PM ^
Ok, so are we playing a game by game comparison? In that case, I'll continue.
We beat Ohio State in Columbus, you beat them at home. And as for Braxton Miller being "light years" ahead of where we played him at, were you actually watching that OSU-UM game? He missed at least three wide open receivers, one of them on a potentially game winning touchdown at the end. So don't act like he was Vince Young back there during your game.
We played the Big Ten Champions twice, beating them once, and barely losing at the end a second time. You never played them.
We played Nebraska on the road at the end of the OSU-UM-Wisconsin gauntlet. Our team was drained, both physically and emotionally, and it showed. You played Nebraska at home, and took advantage of an obscene amount of gaffes on their part to win. But credit where it's due; Michigan certainly played up to their potential that day.
We played Iowa on the road and won convincingly. You played Iowa on the road and lost.
And of course, we beat you fairly convincingly.
All that said, you seem more concerned about making fun of MSU's second place finish in the Big Ten than enjoying your third place finish. At the same time, you call us "obsessed" with you. Don't you see the irony of that?
December 7th, 2011 at 1:16 PM ^
You come on here with that fucking username and expect everyone to roll out the red carpet? You could be the most rational MSU poster on this board but with that username, you're not going to get anything resembling respect around here no matter how reasoned your posts may be.
December 7th, 2011 at 2:15 PM ^
I don't even understand the username. Is he making fun of Denard being the most exciting player in the B1G? If so, that's just silly. I would venture to guess that our honorable friend would take Denard over Cousins every day of the week.
So far, this discussion has been very intelligent and mostly respectful, IMO. But I'm keeping an eye on it. Keep it clean, everyone, and have a good fight!
December 7th, 2011 at 2:02 PM ^
With an inter-state rival, that's understandable. But I've given credit for the way Sparty has played this year. I think you should be very pleased.
Miller played his best game - by leaps and bounds - in his last. Due in no small part to having Posey back. Just because he didn't make every play doesn't mean the overall performance can be dismissed. You played a severely weakened team in Columbus.
Overall, there are arguments on each schedule. We curb-stomped Nebraska (who pummeled you), and beat ND (who handled you easily). Yes, you destroyed Iowa, and we lost a squeaker. Obviously the head-to-head has most weight. If you played poorly against Nebraska, I'll buy that - I think every team has one or two games a year where they play poorly. For us it was Iowa. FWIW, I thought MSU outplayed Michigan and certainly outcoached us (imo errors by our OC). We fixed a lot of that, though.
Watching the B1G Championship, I thought MSU played hard and very well. But I was struck by how awful Wisconsin's defense was. I wouldn't have any fears of Michigan playing that team (that's not to say a win is assumed).
But you're mad about the BCS. Understandable, but not Michigan's issue. If you had won, Wisconsin would be out and we'd be in. If Nebraska and Penn State were playing, whoever lost would be out and we'd be in. That's what happens when you add a 3rd loss. Because you can speculate if Michigan would have had a 3rd loss had it made the B1G, but we know with certainty that MSU would. It must suck that it's Michigan in that position, and that this has happened 2 years in a row (your coach should be complaining more about OSU's cheating, rather than tragic heros). But that's how it went this year. Everyone on Michigan's team has said we'd have rather been playing in the B1G championship.
December 7th, 2011 at 2:45 PM ^
I'm not upset about the BCS. It's a flawed system driven completely by money, and we weren't eligible for it after losing in the BTCG anyway. I'm proud that we had a chance to go to the Rose Bowl, and I'll take that opportunity over a Sugar Bowl berth every time.
Michigan inarguably had a good season this year, though I believe a lot of that had to do with the natural maturation of Rich Rod's talent rather than Brady Hoke's magic dust, but posts like this cheapen the value of such a season. Rather than celebrate the Sugar Bowl, you seem to be more concerned with denigrating MSU for losing in the Championship Game, despite a very comparable year and a division championship to go with it. Coming from a fanbase that likes to cheer themselves with MSU's "obsession" and "inferiority complex", it seems a bit hypocritical.
I mean, seriously, this was a diary?
December 7th, 2011 at 3:52 PM ^
But this is what you're going to see on a rival's board, after your team loses a huge game on a mistake at the end. It's hard to resist the schadenfreude... you know this
You should be enjoying this also. Look at it this way: lose to us 4 years in a row instead of winning, and you won't see any more diaries like this. You won't see anything at all.
December 7th, 2011 at 1:01 PM ^
Don't come on here and say the scheduling argument is laughable. You brought it up. You are in the same division as Michigan - don't tell us your season is materially tougher. You played Wisconsin, so what. They proved to not be the powerhouse that you want them to be - they lost to a 6-6 OSU team before Miller got into a groove, they played an uninspired first 3 quarters against MSU, they're 7-pt dogs in the Rose Bowl and likely to lose by 14+. The B1G has good teams that are inconsistent.
The one consistency in the conference though, that you failed to address and cannot be measured by numbers, is that every team plays their best against Michigan. Watch Braxton Miller connect on 50-yard bombs. Watch Kirk Ferentz coach uncharacteristically aggressively. Watch AJ Jenkins and Illinois' defense play their best game of the season...all against Michigan. We don't play the Iowa team that lost to Minnesota, we don't play the Nebraska team that gets shit-stuffed by Wisconsin. We also don't play teams that are deflated from an emotional game the week before, be it a heartbreaking loss (read: ND) or a season-redeeming win (read: Iowa).
Is Sparty a quality team? Sure. Do they have a ton of young, athletic, aggressive players? Yeah. Were they among the most consistent teams in the conference? Arguably yes. Did they beat Michigan? Yes. Would I pick them and their fan base for a bowl game that I was invested in, over Michigan, Nebraska, Ohio State, Northwestern, Iowa, Wisconsin...? Absolutely not. You guys should play for the Rose Bowl because no one wants to invite you anywhere. I'm glad you're enjoying these couple years because the B1G is going to be a whole lot tougher moving forward. Oh wait, you don't play OSU, Wisconsin or Penn St in the next two years?...why don't you keep that whole schedule argument to yourself for now.
December 7th, 2011 at 2:37 PM ^
Wait, what? The beginning of your post was saying "you're in the same division, the schedules were basically the same" and the end was saying "you don't play OSU, Wisconsin, or Penn State in the next two years, so your schedule sucks!". Despite the fact that that's false information, you just completely contradicted yourself in order to support whatever point you were trying to make.
Oh, and saying "well, ALL teams play Michigan their best, so our schedule is tougher!" is extremely difficult to prove. You're really trying to say that Nebraska played UM better than they played MSU? Since that's the case, Little Brother must have gotten extremely lucky to even keep that UM game close, huh? Since UM beat the Huskers at their best and all, and Lil Bro must have only gotten about 50% of their effort, because it's just Sparty, and teams don't really play unless they're playing Michigan!
Debating this is giving me a headache. You're trying to say that, since Wisconsin lost to the same OSU team in Columbus that had you dancing in the streets for beating in Ann Arbor, they're not a good team? And that teams only give their best to Michigan, so wins over them count more when Michigan is playing them?
December 7th, 2011 at 6:16 PM ^
I will keep it short and direct because you get distracted. The schedule point is moot, and if anything, you will eat your own words in the future. I could very well be wrong on Sparty's schedule, because I don't follow it. The source I pulled could be incorrect, but your schedule will not be materially tougher than Michigan's, Mr. Charmin.
Yes, Michigan does not surprise anyone. They do no catch teams looking at weeks before or after their game.
December 8th, 2011 at 4:23 PM ^
Sure the goal is to go to the Rose Bowl.
Sure it is.
MSU has a quality team. We all know that. What we don't see is any quality fans. You guys had a great year, and all you talk about it how Michigan jobbed you.
December 8th, 2011 at 9:10 PM ^
^^^This.
In case you were not paying attention, Nebraska also passed you by on bowl selection.
They were sitting on the couch next to us when you snagged defeat from the jaws of victory. We high-fived each other.
December 6th, 2011 at 9:11 PM ^
December 6th, 2011 at 9:16 PM ^
There's an interesting thought. Of course, Faust asked him for a wife and it turned out to be Mephistopheles dressed as a woman. Perhaps Dantonio is having a clandestine affair with Saban?
December 6th, 2011 at 9:33 PM ^
December 6th, 2011 at 9:44 PM ^
C'mon, give it a rest. Who cares?
How about a diary on a former UM player who had done well post-football career. I think most here would find that much more interesting and fulfilling.
December 6th, 2011 at 10:48 PM ^
who was a student trainer for the late 80s teams including Mandarich and he told me that steroids were rampant with the players which Mandarich later admitted. Now an MD, he was really disgusted by the whole thing and flipped from the dark side to being a Michigan fan.
I've wondered if the current out of control Sparty team isn't up to their old tricks.
Anyway, if you throw the 1988 Roided Out Sparty team aside they were last legitimately in the Rose Bowl in 1966 or 46 years ago.
That's really pathetic. So for Dantonio to blow that with a punt block call late in the game, and I realize they were behnd at the point but...it was epically stupid.
Moar Sparty bashing on please. It never gets old.
December 6th, 2011 at 11:07 PM ^
December 7th, 2011 at 3:28 PM ^
as to whether Sparty is up to their old tricks, reminiscent of the rampant 1988 steroid scandal, note that agression and criminality are symptoms of steroid use.
I am not accusing them of anything, but remind me:
How has the current MSU team done with their assault record in the past 2 years?
How well are they doing on the field in restraining unnecessary agression, personal fouls, and unsportsmanlike behavior?
December 6th, 2011 at 11:39 PM ^
Trollin' trollin' trollin', get them Sparties trollin'; trollin' trollin' trollin', LILBRO
December 7th, 2011 at 12:40 AM ^
But the OP states MSU hasn't won a bowl game since Saban left. This isn't true. MSU won a bowl game in the 2001 season underBooby Williams
December 7th, 2011 at 7:26 PM ^
He was talking about their absence from a BCS game since saban left. He said "Since Saban left, the latter two teams (coached by Saban) have won multiple national titles—even playing each other for the title now-- yet MSU has not even been able to get to any BCS game at all.""
Elsewhere, unrelated to Saban, he does suggest that MSU in bowl games went essentially zero-for-the-decade---since the last victory was Dec 2001 in the Silicon Valley "classic." Technically, one would have to wait another few weeks for that bowl victory to be 10 years ago (ie midnight on Dec 31) but it will be true then. But do you really want the OP to say that the MSU bowl victory drought was not a decade but 9.9432 years (or 9 years, 341 days, 9 hours and 5 mintues)?
Nevertheless, there was one ambiguous, possibly misleading sentence at the end of the paragraph on Saban. Its placement there might have led one to conclude that the OP implied a bowl winning drought immediately after Saban's departure. The sentence has been revised and the OP thanks you for calling attention to the matter.
December 7th, 2011 at 5:25 AM ^
I noticed this image posted by an MSU fan. Clearly their attempts to depict why they feel they have been "unjustly" denied BCS bowl bids are rather pathetic.
December 7th, 2011 at 8:32 AM ^
Instead of 4 years, why not do 40 years? Barring that, just do one year. Isn't that what a 'season' is? Should we not take into account previous seasons with completely different athletes while deciding BCS entry?
December 7th, 2011 at 9:26 AM ^
Yeah I had this pop up too with all the Sparty's crying over it. Its all about the H2H with MSU, they dont realize that your A. strength of schedule and B. winning of the big games is what actually counts.
December 7th, 2011 at 11:19 AM ^
You know Sparty made this because "received" is misspelled. #HALOL
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