OT - Who would you vote for Most Overrated Player?
Slow day..but curious. Who do you think is the most overrated player in a sport? Maybe not the entire sport, perhaps by position?
Also/Or...most overrated/dissappointing player coming into or going out of Michigan in any sport?
Maybe overrated isn't the right word, but I had high expectations for for D. Terrell and Edwards heading into the NFL.
For transparency, this was inspired my opinion that Brett Favre is the most overrated player in NFL history.
Yeah Jeets!
Please explain to me how a man who spent 20 years in the majors, with the same team, and has 5 World Series rings is overrated?
I don't necessarily hold this view, but the advanced stats guys will tell you Jeter's defensive stats (DVR, etc.) are horrible.
Exactly, every time I asked him to record "Martin" on UPN for me, he completely screwed the pooch.
And is likely going to be a first ballot inductee into the Hall of Fame...
Pinstripes will do that for a player.
eom
Sixth. All-time. And in fewer seasons than anyone else in the top 16.
This alone qualifies him for the Hall of Fame.
As to the other stuff - the "intangibles" - I suppose it can be debated how much they contributed to the 5 championships, but as a Yankee fan, I appreciated that he played hard every day, never made excuses and carried himself with class throughout his career.
and i completely agree with this post. Jeter was a great player. Unlike that overrated, over hyped, only in the hall of fame because of the ironman record, Cal Ripken.
You mean Cal Ripken, 19-time all-star, two-time MVP, eight-time Silver Slugger winner? Career WAR of 96, 37th all-time and more than 20 more than Jeter? You think he was overrated? Mmkay.
The gold gloves are where the problem lies. That should be an honored award to recognize top notch excellence. Yet Jeter was a below average shortstop by advanced metrics and he kept collecting the gold gloves. Other than that, sure, he was awesome -- and I can say that as a lifelong Red Sox fan.
and Ripken won two, plus the dishonest streak of errorless games, despite having less range than the length of my out-stretched arms.
Alot of amazing, great, other worldly baseball players fall short of Mount Rushmore.
Baseball is effectively an individual sport and championships are a team award.
Well, I mean, it is a team game, right? Jeter didn't win 5 Grand Slam tennis or golf titles, right?
He can be a very good player, HOFer even, on great teams, and still be overrated. Right?
His raw advanced metric stats ID him as a fantastic player who would not be thought of in nearly the same light if he'd toiled 20 pennant-less years for the Mariners or Pirates.
Pretty much end of discussion, I think. No one's saying he sucked, just that he may be more popular than great.
He was on great teams. He was a great player too. A top 20 all time offensive player. His defense was grossly overrated though, and that was annoying. He wasn't a top 1000 all time defensive player, yet he won five gold gloves in his thirties when his defense was in decline.
Baseball is really hard to judge. There are so many attachments to counting stats and longevity, and some of that is deserved. I think the five rings speaks volumes. Clearly a hall of famer, and no one would deny that. I think it's just the defense that should be removed from the pedestal.
and people saying Jeter is over rated. I actually think Cal Ripken is a little over rated. Yes he was an iron man and I tip my hat to that, but many will say he hurt the team at times just to keep that streak going and the last few years he was a shell of himself and probably should've been sat down, but the manager wasn't going to stop his streak.
He is definitely a HOF player, but I think the streak put him on a pedestal that probably isn't as deserved as some make him out to be.
I just looked it up, he was a top 5 defensive player all time, and a top 50 offensive player. Sure, the streak became a thing, but he was great for a long time.
The 1998 season was known for 3 things.
#1 Mark McGwire hitting 72 home runs
#2 Sammy Sosa hitting 66 home runs
#3 Cal Ripken playing in his 2,632nd consecutive game
I'll let you all make your own judgements on whether only 2 of these things are related, or all three of them are.
It wasn't that he was overrated on some vast scale, only hearing Jeter mentioned in the same breath as some of the greatest players in the league always felt extreme. He was an extremely good hitter and, at best, an average defender at his peak. His playoff batting numbers were good (308/374/465), but certainly not transcendent. He did hit well for his position (he won a number of Silver Slugger awards and was consistently a leader in WAR for his position), but his peak made him look like a top 10-15 SS (think Trammel and Larkin), not necessary the legend he's treated as.
And I wouldn't read too much into simply winning championships; Robert Horry has 7(!!) NBA titles to his name and never even made an All-Star team.
Jeter was a really good player for a long time, but his greatest achievement was playing in NY and winning titles on some really good teams. Had he played his career in, I don't know, Houston and maybe won 1 title, I doubt he'd be treated quite as well.
Bronxblue says his greatest acheivement was "playing in NY and winning titles on some really good teams"
A top 10-15 ss similiar to Trammell? You mean other than having 1100 more hits than Trammell?
Fuck, for a minute I thought you were talking about the player with the 6th most hits in the history of the game.
Congrats to Jeter on also getting 3000 more at-bats than Trammell. Jeter has more countable stats because he played longer, which is as much to do with the different eras they played in as an actual difference in ability between the two players.
Oh, and Trammell was profoundly better as a defender - pick your favorite metric, but Jeter was a much worse defender than Alan, and was probably even worse than the metrics show because he had such limited range that he oftentimes wasn't even able to get to the area where plays could conceivably get made.
Again, Jeter is a very good player. But the production on the field didn't reach to the level of the platitudes he received both during his career and beyond. If you've got more evidence to back up your claims beyond "exactly as many more hits as you'd expect given the number of additional ABs he got" and "ringzzz", please share it.
Consistenty good over his entire career, did it with one team, did it with class
Brett Favre overrated. That sure is one hot take. I am no Favre fan and hated the Packers, but can't deny that he was one hell of a player.
In that regard!
Seems like more of a Kobe issue to me.
Ehh, I think he's a little overrated. He was a ton of fun to watch in his prime and was pretty damn good for a couple years, but he only won one super bowl and was not the MVP in that one (some random kick return specialist won the award). I'd take Rodgers over Favre.
But would you take O'Korn over Favre?
O'Korn obviously most ready QB in the draft.
Obviously Tacopants is the most overrated WR ever! I mean why would JOK throw to him on almost every down and make himself look bad?
Who was that guy with a Brett Favre fetish that I told Favre wasn't a top five QB of all time? Careful, he will see this and reply 36 times before you even look at this thread again.
old thread...and it prompted this one.
ded.
guy had a serious crush on Favre and Otto Graham